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Author Topic: Re-christening dream  (Read 2076 times)

V

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Re-christening dream
« on: July 07, 2017, 08:37:34 PM »
Dear Tony,

Thanks for this website because it has helped me so much!

I dreamt that I was about to be baptised again in my current age (I’m in my late 20s; I am Catholic and hence was baptised as a baby, and re-baptism does not exist). The baptism was taking place in my small hometown, however not in the same cathedral as that where I was baptised. It was in a smaller cathedral which in real life is right next to where my dad was spending the last few years of his life (an association he was volunteering for has its offices there, and he and his colleagues went for drinks to a bar/café right next to that church; the town is, however, pretty small).
Inside, this cathedral looked different from reality. It was more medieval and ancient, with darker stones, and a warmer light inside (in reality it is a bit unadorned). It had two floors and was pretty narrow. I was near the aisle and talking to some people (possibly local middle-aged women), until I got called up to the floor above. The people were sitting on typical church benches, except the benches were facing the aisle and not, as in regular custom, the altar.
I walked up a narrow staircase made of wrought iron. the staircase was straight and not a spiral one, and it only had the right handrail since it was built right next to a wall. The walls had bricks visible, departing from reality. The floor above was more like a mezzanine/balustrade, rather than a proper separate floor (once I got to the top floor, I could see the aisle below with the people).
I believe I was wearing something white-y, and not a tunic but something more feminine (not a wedding dress). When I got up, my father and my mother were there, and the same priest who did my baptism (or at least I think he did), and who is not the priest of my hometown anymore but who was very much loved by the population.
There was no round baptismal font as usual in Catholic churches. Instead, there was an opening in the floor, a kind of a bath made of stone, not very big, probably the size of a bathroom bath. The atmosphere here was even more mystical, since there was some candles burning like in movies about the middle age, and the nave of the church looked more gothic (which is not the real church). The priest was wearing usual priest gear, and was holding a big chain with an incense holder (customary in the Catholic rite, but unusually big). He was probably blessing the water, which was very clear, as if a light came through it. There was probably someone else on the floor, probably clergy.
My father came to me and hugged me so intensely, and I hugged him back, with so much love. I think this embrace lasted a while. My father in the dream looked the same age as when I was born/had my first birthday (i.e., the year I was baptised), but was wearing the same clothes he was wearing in the last years of his life, when he was much older. That is, he was wearing his signature black leather coat. But he looked young, and smiling. At peace. His eyes were gleaming with peace and love, whereas in life his eyes had always been a bit sad. He was smiling. He was strong and in control.
After this big hug, he pat me on the shoulder and think he accompanied me for a few steps (with his arm wrapped on my shoulders) towards the baptismal “bath”.
I do not have a recollection of the actual baptism happening in the dream.
My mother, instead, was standing a bit behind my father, close to a very big semi-cylindrical sculpture (probably a baptismal itself) and almost leaning on a wall (a stone wall,not a brick wall now). Differently from my father, she looked straight out of the pictures of my real baptism. Her hair was is in the colour and fashion she had at that time. her clothes were the same of those pictures from the early 90s. her demeanour the same. She looked the age she was at the time. She didn’t say anything, and was standing and holding one hand into the other such as when listening to a big speech (or a mass). She smiled politely and sort of unwittingly, shyly, as she used to do. She looked young and naive, as she seemed in those pictures of my real baptism. She didn’t come hug me. She was more a respectful bystander than a participant.
Later in the dream, a guy (let’s call him G.) is looking for a café/bar in my hometown and finding it by talking to people there. I see this scene as a movie, ie. I am not present in this scene. An elderly gentleman (one of those middle-aged people who go from bar to bar in my hometown, something my father used to do too), jokes with G. about something. I then arrive, find G. (we may kiss but I’m not sure), we have a drink and he says how cheap it is, to which I reply that we are not in Milan (where he’s from) so it is cheap, and we then go walking towards the historic centre of my hometown. We are relaxed. It was probably midday or anyways daytime, the sun was shining it was summertime, and not many people in the street (probably at home eating lunch).
This latter part of the dream, I was already drowsy/closer to being awake, so I am not sure how it informs the dream, it was completely abrupt from the baptism scene.

the background to my dream: my father killed himself three months ago (you may have seen other dreams posted by me since I’ve been dreaming a lot ever since). I loved him so much, and we were one of a kind. He was a free spirit, and he had a big heart he gave to everyone he met, without reserve, in its entirety. He loved deeply.
My mother instead suffers from some personality disorder (most likely narcissism), and this is something I have realised less than a year ago. I grew up with her, since my parents separated when I was a child, and was very much enmeshed with her, and manipulated, and my emotions not having a place to be. I did not have a place to simply be and exist with her. since I realised this, our relationship deteriorated, and now she is not even getting in touch with me, possibly because she saw that she is making me feel worse, but not sure.
G. was the first person I truly loved, and since I could not live these feelings with him, I turned them towards myself and slowly started loving myself. This was a catalyst to my awakening and to realising things about my life, such as my mother’s mental problems, and all the consequences this has had on the kind of friendships I form (I moved away from nearly all my “friendships” in the past 1-2 years, they were either one-sided or co-dependent). G. and I were initially attracted, but then he retracted after we spent a night together. he then kept the waters muddy, saying he wanted to be my friend but constantly flirting. In the end, he did not give me friendship, nor love, nothing (apart from work advice), and whenever I asked for explanations, huge fights ensued and created by him. in many aspects G. is similar to my mother. I am sure at some point there were some feelings from his part. With time he became more and more distant and treating me like a buddy. he always insisted on meeting him where he wants and when he wants. I stopped contacting him about 10 days ago, which is a record for me since we had this unhealthy relationship of me writing and he always replying, giving me crumbs of attention, and so hope that this distance will give him the guts to write to me (which he rarely ever did), but I am conscious it may not happen. I am not sure I love him anymore, and I crave closure in this situation, be it for the good or the bad. Being distant, however, is giving me more space to feel my feelings, and I fear having to let go of the very person that made me discover my ability to love.

So a lot for me is going on. I am in a phase of semi-denial where my father’s death seems like a movie. I am unsure of what to do with my professional life, and since I do little jobs for now, I am spending the summer doing nothing but chilling and feeling things (which is not fun at times). I am not working at the moment. I am thinking of moving back to my home country to be close to my roots, but I am very unsure of what to do as I do not feel any energy pull towards anything. I never fully engaged with my life, mostly as a result of having to grow up with a narcissist, and I feel lost because I want to engage with my life fully and do not know how to do it. So I spend my days just looking inside me and letting answers come. In this introspection, I letting myself feel my repressed anger, from my childhood, my mom, how she behaves now and how she has always behaved.
I feel I have lost the only person who ever loved me. there are days where I am deprived of energy and have tiredness/apathy, not wanting to do much. I am not in danger, but I do sometimes think that it would be beautiful to be with my dad now. I would have all his love for me, whereas because of my time of transition right now I feel in a limbo without love and affection. Was my dad showing me his presence and love in the dream? That he is with me although we are in different dimensions?

This dream happened after an emotionally intense day of introspection where I worked on my anger and my boundaries. I then went to a church gathering, where I felt very good and where I have the opportunity to explore and deepen a faith I am just starting to discover. The vicar played a song that made me think of G. Later, I spent an evening in the park, and connected to the earth (feminine energy), and performed yoga under the moonlight. I felt balanced and ready to love and be loved. Unfortunately, as I came home I read an email form my mom asking me for practical things and ignoring how I am again, and I went to bed with some anger.

I feel the dream is about a new life to which I am moving to. One where my true nature (the one I share with my dad) will have a full place to live and express itself, a life where I can love, where I can give. I feel my dad was wishing me good luck and giving me all his love to carry with me in this new life. My mom presented her most human face, the one where she was young and before I became a person with my own needs she could not fulfil (and before probably she became bitter and disenchanted about everything, people, places, situations, money- as she is now). She probably chose to stay on the side and let me go, as she is not able to accompany me on this journey (which is probably what she is doing in real life). Am I separating from both my parents to form my own life?
Does a dream connect only to my own unconscious or also connect me with others’ subconscious or souls? Was it my actual father giving me all that love in that hug? It felt so real. My dad was in the eternal bliss where he is now, he was smiling and everything about him felt abundant and in place. Was it my real mother’s unconscious mind communicating to me in the dream? Was it G.’s subconscious mind communicating something to me? Or was it very simply what he represents to me? Does the whole dream mean that once I will step into this new life of love and following my free spirit, of being true to myself, the man whom I will love will come find me in my own world and we will spend a good and relaxed time together?

I thank you for the patience in reading this. I know it is long, but I am very possibly going through the hardest time of my life, and your help would be invaluable in me directing the questions I am asking of my dream.

thanks and wishing you a good day,

V.

V

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Re: Re-christening dream
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2017, 08:39:58 PM »
A missing detail: I live in a different country from that of my hometown, it is here that I met G., and he has never been to my hometown. I also have come to resent my life in the place I currently live as it feels aseptic and asocial as it was growing up with my mom. I yearn for moving to a place where I can express myself.

Tony Crisp

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Re: Re-christening dream
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2017, 10:38:08 AM »
V – You dreamt that you were to be baptised again, in a bath, not just water sprinkled on you. This literally means a rebirth, a new beginning.

“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.”
The Bible is about huge truths that are describing the inner mysteries of Life. Outside many temples of various religions there is a large container with water to symbolise the cleansing of your life. You dream suggests that you are actually on the path which leads to peace. But the path is one which the first steps are usually face one with the many traumas, mistakes and self created torments. But if you walk the path meeting such difficulties is not bad. For Life itself tells us -  “Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me; for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls, for my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.” (Math 11.29).
You may think I am pushing Christianity. No, I am repeating age old truths about life; ones learnt through millennia. It must remembered that Christianity was not unique and was a new representation of a very old theme.
Mithra was born in a cave, on the 25th December. He was born of a Virgin. He travelled far and wide as a teacher and illuminator of men. His great festivals were the winter solstice and the Spring equinox (Christmas and Easter). He had twelve companions or disciples (the twelve months). He was buried in a tomb, from which however he rose again; and his resurrection was celebrated yearly with great rejoicings. He was called Savior and Mediator, and sometimes figured as a Lamb; and sacramental feasts in remembrance of him were held by his followers.
Osiris was born on the 361st day of the year, say the 27th December. He too, like Mithra and Dionysus, was a great traveller. As King of Egypt he taught men civil arts, and “tamed them by music and gentleness, not by force of arms”; he was the discoverer of corn and wine. But he was betrayed by Typhon, the power of darkness, and slain and dismembered. “This happened,”says Plutarch, “on the 17th of the month Athyr, when the sun enters into the Scorpion” (the sign of the Zodiac which indicates the oncoming of Winter). His body was placed in a box, but afterwards, on the 19th, came again to life, and, as in the cults of Mithra, Dionysus, Adonis and others, so in the cult of Osiris, an image placed in a coffin was brought out before the worshippers and saluted with glad cries of “Osiris is risen.” “His sufferings, his death and his resurrection were enacted year by year in a great mystery-play at Abydos.” Quoted from Pagan and Christian Creeds by Edward Carpenter
The ancient cathedral represents the ancient lessons of life you carry within you. It took place not on the ground floor but raised up, representing a higher level of achievement. You wore white because you became a virgin in your rebirth/baptism. See http://dreamhawk.com/news/how-i-became-a-virgin/

Your father’s love, you must realised that most of us are trapped in old ways of belief and thought, but we must slowly take time to adjust to the NEW.

Therefore, when examining the model of our mind, we need to leave space on one of the walls for a door. It needs to be a door that opens onto a different sort of universe than the one we may previously have felt to be solid reality. It is a universe that alters its appearance – no, its very nature – according to the way we observe it. Each question we ask of the universe, each attitude with which we approach it, each viewpoint we take, reveals to us a different universe. The universe is therefore not separated from us. We are intrinsically a part of it, and are participating in it. In some way the universe is constantly being created by ourselves as participants. It seems as likely too, that we the participants are constantly being created by the universe. And the past is not set in concrete. In some mysterious way it is linked with what we do in the present.

The implications of the quantum theorem are enormous. Something can be in two places at once. Apparently distant objects, or people, are intricately linked in an immediate way. There is no separate existence as we previously thought. Our old view of the world is not one supported by the facts of physics. Time and space are transcended. David Bohm, an eminent physicist, goes as far as to say that all things in our observable universe are inextricable linked. Nothing has separate existence.

At this level we are totally in connection all the time. In dreams we connected with anyone we love, but when we dream about a dead person communicating with us it can be distorted by our view of what death is – or our associations with the dead person. We seldom get a very clear view. But you father’s feeling of love shone through clear, but the images have to be see through ones associations.

But on the path is might help using http://dreamhawk.com/dream-encyclopedia/association-of-ideas-with-dreams/#Working - http://dreamhawk.com/approaches-to-being/opening-to-life/

Tony
« Last Edit: July 09, 2017, 11:00:00 AM by Tony Crisp »

V

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Re: Re-christening dream
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2017, 06:22:26 PM »
Dear Tony,

Thank you so much for your patience in reading my dream and for taking the time to answer. This is helping me so much and your answer resonates a lot with the path I am currently on. I am so grateful for your dedication to helping people access their dreams.

A few points remain: why my parents looked young as in the year I was actually baptised? Does this mean they are staying behind in my “old” life? That I’m taking with me only the good of them (possibly, their good intentions when I was just born, that pure love parents may have when they kids are just babies)? Why did my father look young but wear clothes that were in his recent style over the past few years? Why did my mother look stuck in 1990 clothes-wise, too? Why didn’t she hug me or accompany me towards the bath? Why was the dead parent (also, the one I’m more connected to on a spiritual level, but for whom I feel guilt in not having built a more consistent relationship whilst he was alive) the one accompanying me to the bath? Am I leaving behind the part of me that I identify with my dad, or am I bringing them with me? Do their actions and outlook in the dream represent what I want to take of them with me, since supposedly I should find the same scene once I get out of the baptismal bath?

Also, is it important for the dream that the baptism didn’t actually take place (or that I do not remember it)? Does it mean it is yet to happen?

And what is the meaning of the guy G. appearing in that scene afterwards? Is there a link between the baptism and that scene? And the fact that everything happened in my hometown, ie. where my roots are (even though I moved on over the years and did not connect too much with my homeregion/hometown)? (note also that G. is from the same country as I am, too, and that could be a big factor on why I was attracted to him, I think I missed home all these years (so much so that almost all my interactions with the other sex involved guys from my country) but did not realise it in full until my father’s death).


Thank you,

V.

V

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Re: Re-christening dream
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2017, 06:43:55 PM »
Ever since I took the time to relax and do nothing, I started dreaming more often.
I had a dream two weeks ago which I feel is connected to the baptism scene. It was strange because I do not remember exact details, it was more of a hazy recollection. I woke up with a sensation, rather than a memory, than in the dream my father must have had sex with me, and I was submissive rather than a full participant (it was consensual in the dream, though, not a violence). This must have happened in the kitchen of the flat he lived in (and where he killed himself, although not in the kitchen), and I believe there was another person, probably a young man about my age, right in front of me facing me and my dad (I was not facing my dad), and who just watched (this young person must have been naked).
Before my parents separated, we all lived in that flat (although my dad was away for work most of the time), and kitchen is of course where most things happened, such as fights with my mom, for instance.
Disturbing as it is, I know it has something to do with me living fully and that it represents my inner father. At the time of the dream, I believed it must be me, or my father, or my inner father giving me confidence and strength to face life to the fullest. Maybe it is my father trying to pass onto me that living force that he decided to walk away from.
Or passing the testimony on to someone (the role of the young gentleman just watching?)?
I also have not had full intercourse in a long time, and in general feel that my life has been aseptic and I've been sleepwalking through the past 5-6 years, developing psychosomatic illnesses along the way (incidentally, the same time during which my father apparently started having increasingly debt issues. Incidentally, over the past year I have made leaps forward in my awakening, getting more and more light through darkness....and my dad must have fallen deeper into despair, and deeper into darkness, with less and less light). The same years I moved abroad for good, and went home less and less, and became enmeshed with my mom even more. I am now becoming hungry for life like I have never been and I do feel a lot going on within me.

And now I dream of my father walking me to this new life after the baptism. I believe the two dreams are facets of the same thing.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2017, 06:48:58 PM by V »

Tony Crisp

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Re: Re-christening dream
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2017, 09:02:43 AM »
V - In dreams we may switch to the dimension in which we are in contact with the so called dead. It sounds as if yours was an example of that. The dead looked younger because when they leave the body they usually appear as they were in their prime. This is because in essence, when in the realm of death/dreams, we can be anything we believe we are – male, female, or a being of light. See http://dreamhawk.com/inner-life/journeying-beyond-dreams-and-death/#WHappens

But the questions you ask have so many associations attached to the dream images, personal feelings and associations that I do not know, so have no way of dealing with. So I suggest again trying http://dreamhawk.com/dream-encyclopedia/association-of-ideas-with-dreams/#Working and http://dreamhawk.com/dream-encyclopedia/acting-on-your-dream/#BeingPerson

Obviously that takes work on your part. Or you could use http://dreamhawk.com/dream-encyclopedia/your-guru-the-dream-step-one/

 It matters whether you are a watcher of the sport of life, or a player. A player gets involved, struggles against difficulties, and works toward a goal. Extracting the magic from a dream needs just those qualities. You don’t need to be extraordinary to do that – just an ordinary person with some persistence and courage. If you have that and travel into your dreams, the rewards are like a key opening the door to a magical world.

I am such an ordinary person. I found the key. I opened the door. And I travelled in that magical world! I might be able to help you do the same.

Why would I want to offer you this without asking you for money? After all, it took me years of effort to discover the key, and bloody heartbreak sometimes to enter that magic world.

Well, part of my travels took me under the surface of the world. I went into that strange place of the spirit where all things connect. I saw that my life is interwoven with yours in ways that are beyond understanding. I know that if even one or two of you make that journey and find transformation, my life will be the richer, and the world will have more light and love. (Quoted from Your Guru the Dream).

Tony